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Old 09-03-2013, 09:41 AM   #11
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Well, also think that the ECU controls more than just the engine. So if you use an ECU from an older car in a newer car... one it will fail emissions more than likely due to the ODB computer...

There are several unforeseen problems if you stop and think about everything that the ECU alone controls.
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Old 09-03-2013, 10:47 AM   #12
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Diver:

You can do the upgrades EXCEPT for the camshafts and have it work with the stock computer perfectly.

If the camshafts are upgraded to the type II, more likely than not you will get fuel supply or metering error codes.

The type II intake manifold will be a major upgrade for the 3.5 and will work fine with the stock ECU.

The problem with switching the ECU to a C32 ECU is that the auto transmission controls are built into the ECU. You could practically bolt in a Legend C32 ECU into a 3.5 RL if you used a Legend Auto Transmission, or switched to a 5spd/6spd manual trans.

Carbongray:

Diver is out of the country and doesn;t have to worry about emmisions.


-Matt
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Old 09-03-2013, 11:17 AM   #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sr5guy View Post
Diver:

You can do the upgrades EXCEPT for the camshafts and have it work with the stock computer perfectly.

If the camshafts are upgraded to the type II, more likely than not you will get fuel supply or metering error codes.

The type II intake manifold will be a major upgrade for the 3.5 and will work fine with the stock ECU.

The problem with switching the ECU to a C32 ECU is that the auto transmission controls are built into the ECU. You could practically bolt in a Legend C32 ECU into a 3.5 RL if you used a Legend Auto Transmission, or switched to a 5spd/6spd manual trans.

Carbongray:

Diver is out of the country and doesn;t have to worry about emmisions.


-Matt
Thank you Matt.

What about Type II springs? As I understood it will make sense only if ECU will be upgraded and for example redline will be moved and fuel map will be changed?

So the question, is it possible to upgrade the stock C35A ECU (or how it's called... chip tuning)?

And in case if the camshafts will be upgraded to the type II, the ECU upgrade could possibly fix the problem with fuel supply or metering error codes ????

Sorry, it's possible that I do not fully understand what the chip upgrade include.
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Old 09-03-2013, 11:46 AM   #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by diver View Post
Thank you Matt.

What about Type II springs? As I understood it will make sense only if ECU will be upgraded and for example redline will be moved and fuel map will be changed?

So the question, is it possible to upgrade the stock C35A ECU (or how it's called... chip tuning)?

And in case if the camshafts will be upgraded to the type II, the ECU upgrade could possibly fix the problem with fuel supply or metering error codes ????

Sorry, it's possible that I do not fully understand what the chip upgrade include.
The problem with a "chip" upgrade is that all 96+ honda ECU's moved away from using a separate ROM chip (like the 91-95 legend) and store the ROM program on the microprocessor directly. The second problem is that in most of these ECU's the microprocessors are not flash upgradable versions which means that they are "locked" into their stock program (honda didn't start making flash upgrade ECU's until 2006+). This is not to say it can't be done, but the difficulty is quite high. The stock mictroprocessor has to be removed, the internal rom program has to be read out and then a new (flash version) microprocessor has to be installed with updated, tuned programming. I have simply not seen enough interest in the 96-04 acura RL's to invest any time into developing a "chip" for them.

-Matt
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Old 09-03-2013, 02:00 PM   #15
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^^^

Well said and thank you for clearing up some details.
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Old 09-03-2013, 04:27 PM   #16
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Holy beginning of time bump! Lol
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Old 09-03-2013, 05:39 PM   #17
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Holy beginning of time bump! Lol
If he didn't bump it you'd be complaining that he didn't search. . can't win...
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Old 09-03-2013, 10:18 PM   #18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sr5guy View Post
The problem with a "chip" upgrade is that all 96+ honda ECU's moved away from using a separate ROM chip (like the 91-95 legend) and store the ROM program on the microprocessor directly. The second problem is that in most of these ECU's the microprocessors are not flash upgradable versions which means that they are "locked" into their stock program (honda didn't start making flash upgrade ECU's until 2006+). This is not to say it can't be done, but the difficulty is quite high. The stock mictroprocessor has to be removed, the internal rom program has to be read out and then a new (flash version) microprocessor has to be installed with updated, tuned programming. I have simply not seen enough interest in the 96-04 acura RL's to invest any time into developing a "chip" for them.

-Matt

I see. Thank you for clarifications, Matt. Now I understand.

So, can I underline all what was told and make some outputs? Please confirm my view

Variants of Type II modifications for Acura RL C35A / Honda Legend KA9 C35A - (1996-2004):

With C35A ECU - it is not flashable... it is possible to make it flashable, but in another life
- It is possible to install C32A Type II Intake Manifold

With C32A ECU - it is flashable, but it will properly work only with 91-95 Legend's AT or 5-6 speed MT (ECU will permit to move redline to higher RPMs, change ignition timing fuel maps etc.)
- It is possible to install C32A Type II Intake Manifold + T2 Camshafts + T2 Valves + T2 Springs + T2 Heads + T2 Fuel Injectors + T2 Fuel rails with regulator etc. , of course with additional modifications.


Questions:
- Please advise what will give replacement of only intake manifold to T2 manifold? I'm not sure about horse power, but may be some more torque on low RPMs? And what about fuel injectors and fuel rails with regulator? Should it be also replaced?

- If C35 ECU is locked, then it means that it is impossible to remove even japan speed limit (180km/h)?

- Which transmission is better? 2001 RL's AT or 91-95 Legend's AT in terms of acceleration, quality and lifetime?



Matt,

My friend is restoring JDM Honda Legend KA8 1994 C32A (Type I) with AT.
So when he will be ready, can I ask you for help with chip for it without major modifications in engine?

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Old 09-04-2013, 08:36 AM   #19
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Diver View Post
I see. Thank you for clarifications, Matt. Now I understand.

So, can I underline all what was told and make some outputs? Please confirm my view

Variants of Type II modifications for Acura RL C35A / Honda Legend KA9 C35A - (1996-2004):

With C35A ECU - it is not flashable... it is possible to make it flashable, but in another life
- It is possible to install C32A Type II Intake Manifold

With C32A ECU - it is flashable, but it will properly work only with 91-95 Legend's AT or 5-6 speed MT (ECU will permit to move redline to higher RPMs, change ignition timing fuel maps etc.)
- It is possible to install C32A Type II Intake Manifold + T2 Camshafts + T2 Valves + T2 Springs + T2 Heads + T2 Fuel Injectors + T2 Fuel rails with regulator etc. , of course with additional modifications.

Correct!
Questions:
- Please advise what will give replacement of only intake manifold to T2 manifold? I'm not sure about horse power, but may be some more torque on low RPMs? And what about fuel injectors and fuel rails with regulator? Should it be also replaced?


It should open up the top end of the motor providing at least 10 horsepower with a slight reduction in torque.

- If C35 ECU is locked, then it means that it is impossible to remove even japan speed limit (180km/h)?

Yes, speed limiter is not removable without a re-flash

- Which transmission is better? 2001 RL's AT or 91-95 Legend's AT in terms of acceleration, quality and lifetime?

The RL and Legend transmission are of the same general construction, they use the same manufacturer, almost the same case and many of the same internal parts. The difference is in the gear ratios and sensor connectors. Note that there are also 2 different Legend auto transmissions which also have slightly different gear ratios - The Type I (MPY3) and Type II (R/S/MPX9)


Matt,

My friend is restoring JDM Honda Legend KA8 1994 C32A (Type I) with AT.
So when he will be ready, can I ask you for help with chip for it without major modifications in engine?


Yes, you should have at the very least some type of intake tube - short ram or CAI
-Matt
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Old 09-04-2013, 09:44 AM   #20
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Thank you Matt for very clear explanation of everything!
Now I know what wanted.
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